Moto Guzzi Club GB Forum: Bellagio banter

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Grant
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Posted: 07 Jul 2009 at 21:21

David,

I just have to say I love the idea of keeping all of the Bellagio stuff on one thread, rather than having many threads to keep track of! Again, my maths isn't great, but I think I counted around 7 active Bellagio riders posting on the forum. Not sure if there are others on the club side.

Your weekend set up looks great for 2 people actually. Looking at a weekend pack, I must've been delirious to think I could take the Bellagio to Europe for 2 months without having to rely on getting everything posted to me Ouch

For weekendsI have managed to get it down to a Kriega tailpack for a weekend (no pillion then) and ACF50 (yeah - don't ask...!) I am environmentally conscious though and I don't like using bic disposable razors which take up more volume LOL

. I'd thoroughly recommend a Wilkinson Quattro titanium!

Do you have any closer images of your pillion perch Dave? I tend to just hope for the best when it comes to pillion + staying on perch!

Listen to the Willard Grant Conspiracy!

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guzzibear
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Posted: 07 Jul 2009 at 23:40

I duno about a bellagio BUT I can get all I need in the tank bag and on the sports rack of the V11 Le mans. Mind you I use the idea 3 pairs of "stuff". Wear 1, 1 clean , 1 to wash and rotate. Shorts under leathers OR Draggin jeans give easy alternative.

Western "Roper" Boots are as good and better than alot of bike boots. They are waterproof, have a built in plate in the instep and are easy to walk in and will work on the cali and bellagio bike and look Kool.

The roper boot is designed for a working rider so they are sturdy but with lower heels than "cowboy" boots. Mine were £89

http://www.wayoutwestonline.com/ContactInfo.html

Mine are "wolf" roper boots all day comfy too

"The older I get, the better I was!"
Leics

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940V
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Posted: 08 Jul 2009 at 09:10

Hya Bob. here is a shot of the spare 'comfort' seat placed over the top of the original saddle to give you an idea just how much more space is made available for a pillion passenger.

click: http://72.41.238.69/ComfSt.jpg

They are actually marketed as the 'comfort seat' and this is a genuine Moto Guzzi part and is of high quality finish (naturally).

Prices vary upto £200.00 but i got mine at the same time as i ordered the bike for an extra £127.00 over list

They became the standard fitment on the later silver Bellagio, but i think that the black Bellagio looks soooo right with the original sort of bobber/gunfighter saddle as part of this bikes overall aesthetics.

So i only use the comfort seat when carrying a pillion rider, but of course it could be used as a substantial base for a tail pack to augment the tank bag if touring solo.

For the rider, you will notice a subtle difference in the height and riding position as the comfort saddle is sculpted differently allowing both feet to be planted flat on the floor while the original seat that appears lower actually only allows a stationary stance on the soles of your boots with heels slightly raised.

There are soft throw-over style pannier bags available too from the same source, so really, with the full set of luggage carrying options there plus a ruck-sack/back pack you have got a fair bit of capacity there partic. if you use hon. member guzzibears travel tips too.

Wilkinson Quattro Titanium eh? blimey that sounds like a mid engined V8 muscle car....What ever happened to lathering with a brush and scraping away with a blue gillette when you are such a traditionalist sort o' fella ?

j.../k of course

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940V
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Posted: 08 Jul 2009 at 09:15

Originally posted by guzzibear

... Mind you I use the idea 3 pairs of "stuff". Wear 1, 1 clean , 1 to wash and rotate. Shorts under leathers OR Draggin jeans give easy alternative. ...

Attaboy gb ! ... Jut add a couple o' bic disposables or one of Grant's hi falutin turbocharged cut throat razors and that's called travelling with soul !

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guzzibear
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Posted: 08 Jul 2009 at 12:03

I have an old cutthroat razor and use my leather belt.

I have a mate who's idea of bike touring is:-

Bike, leathers/ bumbag waterproofs, Platinum card and toothbrush Oh and the nearest Hotel/travelodge etc.

Went to Italy on his bike, fedex'd his clothes on to hotel and fedex'd them home just had a tank bag for a few bits he may need en route.

Way to go if y can afford it.

"The older I get, the better I was!"
Leics

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940V
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Posted: 08 Jul 2009 at 21:50

Originally posted by guzzibear

I have an old cutthroat razor and use my leather belt.

I have a mate who's idea of bike touring is:-

Bike, leathers/ bumbag waterproofs, Platinum card and toothbrush Oh and the nearest Hotel/travelodge etc.

Went to Italy on his bike, fedex'd his clothes on to hotel and fedex'd them home just had a tank bag for a few bits he may need en route.

Way to go if y can afford it.

It's not that always expensive gb...Somewhere-else on the forum today, i have tried to convey this mssg to a potential new Bellagio fan.

But then...why should i give away the "golden key" that separates these two ideologies?

I have farque hall except for my machine and the clothes on my back. Life is a transient and always is in flux and subject to sudden or immediate change.

I will always be a motorcyclist because i feel a comfortable synergy with what that brings to my life.

But if tomorrow, it all goes teets oop, i won't starve to death or anything stupido like that.... I'll just go to ground for a while and do "woofin" then re-emerge with something motorbikingly wierder than a chinese copy of a BSA Bantam.

....Meanwhile, has anybody explored the capacity of the under-seat storage area on the B/laggio?...It's like a mini version of the tardis actually, and is well capable of accommodating extra oddments that one may need if ones consort gives one the elbow due to sudden incompatability.

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940V
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Posted: 15 Jul 2009 at 21:43

Hya.

Brief break there while essential stuff has to be done. Do you know, i have bust my nads for a week-or-so, alternately sweating like a leaky sieve or battling through thunderous downpours as me an's the spirit within seek to fulfill some amazing project...Anyway, enuff of the bllx...

I often found myself musing as i toiled away, hmmm wonder if any other riders had actually hunted down and finally got one of these Bellagio's.

Y'know, i think (sometimes) that this particular machine has been so mis-represented that it's almost a tradgedy for the loving care that went into creating this little jewel to be swept away by a market driven nonesense that killed it in the cot so to speak.

I really don't want to sound like a barsteward here, but i'm afraid that once the curtains are pulled on the village workshop mentality that seems to abound near the shores of lake como...There will be tonnes of euro's to spend on putting this fabulous 940 power unit/tranny into a format that is more widely popular with the non-croozer community.

I mean, let your head spin...Can you imagine with all that "parts bin raider" design philosophy how you coud get a 1200 Griso cunningly to look exactly like the Blagger by just a few 1000 lira's worth of chop 'n change?... or indeed to turn the stock V7 Cafe classic into a most rewarding cafe racer with a damn near thouand V twin motor in it!

Me, I've had it with all the fancy stuff...My machine is not going to be for sale and i certainly am going on to do an individual customisation to make it even more individual.

The stage is set, i have an initial shopping list and a few engineering aspects to resolve, it shall be done (but i'll keep the original swag)

...Not to leave any wonderment, but this bike is heading toward an extremely mild streetfighter look that sits nicer in my mind than the current pretend hardley thing that jarres on it.

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DaveR
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Posted: 16 Jul 2009 at 21:36

Hi David

Look forward to seeing your take on the Bellagio.

My Black Bess is the only bike I have owned so far that will, I hope, remain virtually standard.

I bought the Bellagio totally on looks alone, the discovery that the bike was an absolute peach on the road only reinforced the conviction that I had made the right descision.

The styling, to me at least, is in the same bracket as the Triumph X75 Hurricane and Norton Commando 'S', two bikes which I would not change if I owned them.

Be a dull old world if we all thought the same, good luck with the job.

All the best

Dave R

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940V
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Posted: 17 Jul 2009 at 09:33

Originally posted by DaveR

Hi David

Look forward to seeing your take on the Bellagio.

My Black Bess is the only bike I have owned so far that will, I hope, remain virtually standard.

I bought the Bellagio totally on looks alone, the discovery that the bike was an absolute peach on the road only reinforced the conviction that I had made the right descision.

The styling, to me at least, is in the same bracket as the Triumph X75 Hurricane and Norton Commando 'S', two bikes which I would not change if I owned them.

Be a dull old world if we all thought the same, good luck with the job.

All the best

Dave R

Hi DaveR.

Congratulations on joining the "Bellagisti" and welcome to this little corner of the forum where no doubt you'll soon be tagged Dave the 8th.

Interesting comments there about style comparisons and i agree that this style of machine should have been pitched more along those lines than to be guaged against the HD sporty or the Bonnie America.

Yes, the Bellagio is a beauty for sure and as you soon found out, what a great 'riding' bike it is too. For me, it has "pin up" status when viewed from the drive side, but the standard silencers set-up even though they are high quality Lafranconi's, are way too heavy and they are set wrongly plus the collector box and outlet pipes not only get in the way of your heels but the bend radius looks ill thought out and dare i say, a tad fugly.

To sort this aspect out, i have been in touch with Roy at OSS pipes and he will be fabricating a replacement collector box (sans cat) with probably an upswept Conti style pair of slim stacked megga's, but that bit will be finalised in due course.

So, that will take care of the V twin "real" audio and hopefully complement the remainder of the styling tweaks to...ahem...pimp my ride

I won't lay all my cards on the table and fill this post with a list of the mods i'm going to do, but there are not that many needed actually.

For example, those Honda Dream style plastichrome indicatore are off to room 101, to be replaced with some satin black anodised billet L.E.D. mini-indies from Oberon. >>>>>

http://www.oberon-performance.co.uk/acatalog/motorcycle-indicators-led.html

Also sourced from Oberon are a pair of black bar-end mirrors to clean up the clutter off those fabulous drag-bars by ditching those chromed elbow reflectors fitted as std. equipment.

I'll be fabbing some bracketry to tidy up the numberpate/tail section, and to fit a twin lamp nose cone fairing from Simpson Side products.

I've used one of these B4 on a naked SV Thou' and once it's been pro. sprayed to colour code it to the same satin black finish on the tank, it should look "just like grew there" >>>>>>

http://www.simpson-detour.co.uk/img.asp?OBJ_ID=135280

http://72.41.238.69/20067.gif

This is a neat solution to the aftermarket flyscreen aesthetics and also upgrades the candlepower quite radically too. OK it's a real step away from the retro single headlamp look, and some Guzzi affictionado's may be aghast but this bike isn't a traditional Guzzi in every sense is it?

It's a lightweight compact street rod actually that sit's not quite in the full-on streetfighter genre and also on the fringes of the custom cruiser as if it's got an identity crisis goin' on

I'll lay money that theres another 5-10 bhp and another dollop of torque to be unlocked in this unit merely by tuning out all the legislative restrictions imposed by EU emission laws alone as i have found out previously with the SV1K and the Buell XB9 Lightning.

I'll post pics as things progress and look forward to reading of your experiences too as you carry on "bonding" with your Black Beauty.

More Ltr.

Dave the 4th.

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guzzibear
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Posted: 17 Jul 2009 at 11:38

Getting rid of the cat will inc HP as will more open zorsts and inlet. But is should be interesting to see when finished.

"The older I get, the better I was!"
Leics

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guzzijack
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Posted: 17 Jul 2009 at 17:35

Originally posted by guzzibear

Getting rid of the cat will inc HP.....

How so?

GJ

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DaveR
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Posted: 17 Jul 2009 at 18:49

Hi David

Many thanks for your kind words of welcome.

I bought my Bellagio as an ex-demo from the very excellent Rockingham Classics & Sports (my local MG dealer and the second bike I have had from them), two months old and with 200 miles on the clock. At 1300 miles it just keeps getting better as everything loosens up, the gearbox in particular.

Will visit my local section (Leics) at the end of the month and see you all at Dunchurch in August.

Btw, agree with you about the exhaust kink and have though about extending the heel guard as a start. (Oh no, here we go!)

Bye for now,

Dave R

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940V
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Posted: 17 Jul 2009 at 19:32

Originally posted by DaveR

...Btw, agree with you about the exhaust kink and have though about extending the heel guard as a start.

(Oh no, here we go!)....

Bye for now,

Dave R

"D8"

... C'mon now! Enjoy this amazing bike and get your errr..creative juices flowing again... See, straight off you noted one p.i.t.a. that needs addressing in only a tad over the first 1000 mls.

Live it ans love it Dave, theres no dress rehersal in loife ol' froot

Next, i will deal with an enquiry from another recent in-putter who shows scant regard for the aesthetic tones that we speak of, but more of a passing interest in power gains.

....Naaar, to spring to the defense of gb who advocates the removal of catatonic distorters..koff..i mean catacysmic contorteres...

Never mind, if you don't know Jack poop about stoich or t.r.e's a.ka. noise abatement logic or megaphonitis/detonation...let's not waste our breath and keep this about the looks of the machine instead of heading off into the engine tuning jungle of fuel injection ecm's.

Anyway Mr. I'd love to talk at length with you about these aspects of the project, but this stuff is top secret except to the few within the tontine, so rather than have to kill you having imparted this information, i extend a hand of friendship and wish you well on your future path.

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Lawrence
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Posted: 17 Jul 2009 at 19:35

Originally posted by guzzijack

Originally posted by guzzibear

Getting rid of the cat will inc HP.....

How so?

GJ

if its anything like the B750's cat construction then it could be a significant blockage, sort of long honeycomb thing with small passages that limits the flow at upper revs

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guzzijack
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Posted: 17 Jul 2009 at 20:13

Originally posted by Lawrence

Originally posted by guzzijack

Originally posted by guzzibear

Getting rid of the cat will inc HP.....

How so?

GJ

if its anything like the B750's cat construction then it could be a significant blockage, sort of long honeycomb thing with small passages that limits the flow at upper revs

Maybe so, but that doesn't necessarily mean that just by pulling it out of the exhaust tract you WILL get an increase in BHP does it? As the engine has been developed with exhaust backpressure of the CAT in situ it could just as easily mean that a BHP sucking flat spot might be created somewhere in the rev range.

Without some, (maybe a lot of), dyno work and the ability to remap the fuelling and ignition, (has it been done with that ECU yet?), it might achieve zilch or even less.

More noise might give the impression of greater power but it's not conclusive.

Edited by guzzijack - 17 Jul 2009 at 20:15

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johnno
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Posted: 17 Jul 2009 at 20:36

Originally posted by guzzijack

[QUOTE=Lawrence][QUOTE=guzzijack] [QUOTE=guzzibear] Getting rid of the cat will inc HP.....[/

More noise might give the impression of greater power but it's not conclusive.

i agree but it will be lighter worth it just for that

loughborough
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XPA V75,V65 tt,850 T5,1100 sport RIDER

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Brian UK
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Posted: 17 Jul 2009 at 23:16

All the late 5AM bikes run closed loop with a lamda sensor, and tend to self adjust if the cat is removed. The Norge does produce about 4 bhp more with the staintune silencer, with no flat spots, and better fuel economy too.

Brian.
Surrey.

Make tea, not war, it's cheaper!

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Tnarg
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Posted: 18 Jul 2009 at 14:34

Originally posted by 940V

Hya Bob. here is a shot of the spare 'comfort' seat placed over the top of the original saddle to give you an idea just how much more space is made available for a pillion passenger.

......

So i only use the comfort seat when carrying a pillion rider, but of course it could be used as a substantial base for a tail pack to augment the tank bag if touring solo.

Hi Dave,

sorry for the delay - no internet access and now I can't remember my login details!

Soooo....you got a comfort seat to loan?! Big%20smile

Actually, it's the sissy bar add-on I think is more important! I'm not sure how often I'll have a pillion. Is the 'comfort' seat more comfortable for a 1 up rider, and not just for the pillion? Hard to believe anything can be more comfy than the bella nero Bellagio seat.

I still haven't sorted out ideas for pannier style bags. The Bellagio custom panniers are terrifically expensive so I'm still stalling on that one. Having said that, I haven't decided about going back to England to grab the bike for touring still..

Not traditionalist, but mod retro 'cuse me! Thumbs%20Up

No time to use band aid with those awful scab inducing blue gillettes! I spend as much time shaving as I do cleaning my bike lol. Which is not many.

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Tnarg
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Posted: 18 Jul 2009 at 14:42

Originally posted by DaveR

Hi David

Look forward to seeing your take on the Bellagio.

My Black Bess is the only bike I have owned so far that will, I hope, remain virtually standard.

I bought the Bellagio totally on looks alone, the discovery that the bike was an absolute peach on the road only reinforced the conviction that I had made the right descision.

The styling, to me at least, is in the same bracket as the Triumph X75 Hurricane and Norton Commando 'S', two bikes which I would not change if I owned them.

Be a dull old world if we all thought the same, good luck with the job.

All the best

Dave R

Welcome Dave the VIIIth! LOL

Congratulations on your Bellagio - I take it you have the bella nero Bellagio then? Spot on about the looks. It's just achingly beautiful it's amazes me everytime I throw the bike covers off and look at her (except those kidney spots on the head collector grumble grumble).

The look of the Bellagio on paperwork is just as extraordinary. Dave the Vth [940V] Big%20smile

nails the issue about the marketing failure of this superb little bike. I tend not to read marketing drivel on bikes, otherwise I'd own everything I read.

Sounds like you're a classic bike rider fan too. The Bellagio is the first classic bike I've owned. Really sweet handling that I just can't get enough of. Love to see photos of your bike when you have time too.

Cheers.

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Guests
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Posted: 18 Jul 2009 at 19:50

Got to try one of these one day.

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Mark Bellagio
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Posted: 18 Jul 2009 at 20:15

Welcome Tnarq to the Bellagisti group! I reckon we've got about 9 Bellagio owners now

Where abouts are you based?

Cheers!

Mark

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Tnarg
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Posted: 18 Jul 2009 at 20:22

Howdy Mark -

It's Rob without password access to Grant (Tnarg) :(

Since heading over to France, I haven't been able to log into the site.

8 Bellagisti here.

So who's interested in a meet up in the French pyrenees? Big%20smile

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Mark Bellagio
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Posted: 18 Jul 2009 at 21:58

Hi Rob,

Just worked out from Dave (940V)'s post on other thre

ad that Tnarg is of course a pallidrome

So, we're still 8 Bellagisti.

Hope you're keeping well in Europe!

Cheers

Mark

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Tnarg
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Posted: 18 Jul 2009 at 23:07

Thanks Mark....it's great being over here.

I found a little Guzzi shop and picked up a little tank bag (or pouch rather). It's the neatest little tank bag I've ever seen - completely impractical except for holding a pair of sunglasses or a few CDs and a Wilkinson Quattro. Or blue cheapos for Dave the IVth Wink

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940V
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Posted: 19 Jul 2009 at 11:52

Quote Tnarg....errrr. or should that be Obo now?

Hi Rob. To be honest there is not much difference at all in that they are so plush and comfortable but as i explained before, there is a subtle difference in the seating position due to the comfort seat being sculpted into a more pillion friendly shape.

I was interested in your sissy bar add on thoughts, and as the bike is currently stripped out as w.i.p. job i took a few shots that you may be interested in should you consider persuing that option.

Here, you can see the two open ends of the frame rails. they are around 25mm i.d. This would be the start point of a sissy bar mod i'd think.

This shot is a mock-up to illustrate two clearance holes that would need to be cut in to the tail section valance to pass the ends of the backrest support bars en-route to connecting to the two frame rail sockets.

The holes in the valance could be trimmed neatly by using two rubber grommets to fit snug to the backrest rails where they pass through.

Regarding connection to the frame, i would get a jobbing engineer to turn some steel or dural reducing bungs to set the size of the sissy bar to approx 15mm like the proprietory aftermarket ones out there, then the bungs could be secured in the frame rails by drilling and tapping for two locking bolts.

This way, you could easily buy a ready made basic sissy bar and do some minor mods to marry it up to the new sockets now provided for it.

If you find chopping up a new bike's plastic is too freaky, always rem. that in bike customising the first cut is the deepest as the ol' song goes, but you could always buy a spare one to revert it to standard in a mere twinkle

Clean bobber tail line now

Visualisation of sissy bar line of exit from the valance

Bella undergoing the frontal lobotomy required to fit the Simpson Predator nose cone fairing.

.... Anyway, most of the cosmetics will be done probs. abt next w/e and i'll update with more pics. The exhaust will be the last part to complete the job, but that will have to wait 'till Aug due to funding requirements.

(....i.e. i can't afford that yet)

Mark: i wondered why you hadn't twigged it was Grant in mirror text

ScottyOz: If you try one, bet you'll be hooked and you'd then be D9!!!

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Brian UK
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Posted: 19 Jul 2009 at 12:03

You do know that Hepco & Becker make a rear rack for the Bellagio?

All you need to know here.

http://forum.guzzitech.com/images/fbfiles/files/BellagioTopBoxInstall.pdf

Brian.
Surrey.

Make tea, not war, it's cheaper!

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940V
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Posted: 19 Jul 2009 at 12:10

Originally posted by Brian UK

You do know that Hepco & Becker make a rear rack for the Bellagio?

All you need to know here.

http://forum.guzzitech.com/images/fbfiles/files/BellagioTopBoxInstall.pdf

Duh! well i do now

Thank you Brian, seems like they were thinking along the same lines as moi regarding the frame rail connecting points.

Are they very expensive like?

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Tnarg
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Posted: 19 Jul 2009 at 12:23

Originally posted by Brian UK

You do know that Hepco & Becker make a rear rack for the Bellagio?

All you need to know here.

http://forum.guzzitech.com/images/fbfiles/files/BellagioTopBoxInstall.pdf

Oh I get it....what a brilliant idea!

The pillion fits inside the top box..... LOL

I've the Hepco option before but like most bikes, the top box just destroys the look of the Bellagio. I'm starting to think, the factory panniers are the only thing that will look fine. As for pillions....I guess that's why there's a train and bus service Big%20smile

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Tnarg
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Posted: 19 Jul 2009 at 12:31

Quote Tnarg....errrr. or should that be Obo now?

Errr....Dave the IVth - behave yourself! I'll be Grant when I get back to England :)

I was interested in your sissy bar add on thoughts, and as the bike is currently stripped out as w.i.p. job i took a few shots that you may be interested in should you consider persuing that option.

I'm wondering actually, if pillions don't find life on the rear seat without a sissy bar too difficult, it may be find for a few days touring the hard end of the stub of a seat for the bella nera Bellagio. My handiwork skills amount to two left hands and a spade hammer. :)

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Brian UK
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Posted: 19 Jul 2009 at 17:57

I have no idea of the price I'm afraid. Any dealer who sells H& B should be able to find out, but if you have a problem in that respect, Jenny at http://www.touringbiker.com/default.aspx is extremely helpful, and they do sell, at a good price, H & B stuff.

Of course using a top box with the rack is not obligatory Grant/Tnarg.

Brian.
Surrey.

Make tea, not war, it's cheaper!

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